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Old 05-12-2009, 05:41 AM   #11
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All of what you say is true, Equilibrium. I would add that there are many people who will only do what helps themselves directly; things that can be done to help the community as a whole (but are not of direct benefit to themselves) aren't worth consideration. It's a very complex equation and I fear that we will soon reach the point where we all sink or swim together. Unfortunately, we'll only realize that when we discover that we're all sinking, together.
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Old 05-12-2009, 06:58 PM   #12
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All too often I work with people who shirk their responsibilities. It's a sad thing when so many know no other way other than to look to others. There are many who truly are in a rough situation but not as many as we would think. Personal responsibility seems to be dying a slow death.
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Old 05-12-2009, 10:40 PM   #13
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It's the few who are really in rough shape who pull at my heart strings. It was for them I voted to allocate more funds toward the incentive program. I was treated like a leper when I shared how I voted. I don't begrudge those families that are truly in need anything. It's the families with the bad case of the "gimmies" that would have everyone believing their situation is "bigger" "badder" and "worser" than everyone else's situation that make me so mad I could spit BBs. They hurt the little guys even more. It's those people with their greedy open hands looking for something for nothing that got us in the spot we're all in. If all the people who could have gone a few more years without buying a new car or gone without that big screen tv or that vacation to Disneyworld would have taken advantage of the incentive... we wouldn't have a septic field inspector on the payroll and there would have been more money available for the families that really needed the money. Just my 1.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:31 PM   #14
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My question is, why does a new septic drain field cost $8,000? Or $25,000? Why does the testing cost $225/year?

Why is it necessary to hire a "specialist" who charges top dollars ... for a bulldozer, gravel, dirt, a level, some PVC? For a test tube and lab test? It's not magic. What's the real cost? Why not make it more reasonable? Or something that can be done themselves, with monitoring/quality control.
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Old 05-14-2009, 09:15 PM   #15
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There was a time when you could build a cabin, set up an outhouse, and live your life with very little cash. Those times are over, but many people living in the boonies have their heads in the past. I suspect that it is the big polluters, the big generators of pig manure and chicken manure, who are doing most of the damage to Chesapeake Bay. All of this should have been handled back in the 20th century, but we still have people living in the 19th. The bay is too important do let it continue to decline. Somehow, we have to keep it in the foreground, up for discussion.
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Old 05-14-2009, 09:51 PM   #16
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We had mink farmers in our area. They're gone now. For us it's all the Thoroughbred farms. There are more horses than people in my community. We're outnumbered by 3 to 1 I've heard. That's a lot of manure. Back when our population wasn't so out of control, one could have their outhouse and call it a day. We can't do that any longer. The combined waste of humans and pets is too much of a strain on the environment. We're beyond our carrying capacity and sooner or later the straw will break the camel's back. All septic fields where I live are designed based on the site and approved by the health department. All drawings need to be stamped by a PE or they don't stand a chance of being approved and you lose your fee. I stand corrected on the costs of a septic field in my area. They are now up to around $30,000. That does include lift stations, aeration units, tanks, filters, pumps, alarms, etc. What it does not include is the annual inspection fee or the fee to remove solids from the tanks every 3 years to ensure they don't discharge through the overflows. We have to sign a contract that this work will be performed at least once every three years by a licensed professional who is registered with the board of health. That costs about $750. The water is potable once it leaves the field. The $225 fee covers an annual site inspection. The man who comes out is licensed and registered with the department of health. He literally inspects the septic field and notes any deficiencies which are then reported to the septic field gods who give you x number of days to address deficiencies. If a septic field fails, they condemn the house.
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Last edited by Equilibrium; 05-14-2009 at 09:55 PM. Reason: adding why the $225 fee.
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Old 05-15-2009, 06:53 AM   #17
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You know, other than the problem of not using the product on food crops, composting toilets are such a better solution. Keeps the problem out of the water supply from the get-go.

There are large-scale applications, some in use in Europe. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composting_toilet

I'm waiting for the guy with the pump truck as we speak, ironically enough. If I lived where Equilibrium lives, this house would be in danger of condemning, because he was supposed to be here Wednesday, and Issues Have Developed Further since then.
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:56 AM   #18
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I never knew I was so lucky, I use the public waste system so if anything goes wrong the city has to fix it (except my pvc to the city hookup). I upgraded to new PVC from old clay pipe one time and that only cost a whopping 900$ to completely redo. Worst thing I can imagine is having to buy a new toliet
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:14 PM   #19
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They were attempting to bring city water and city sewers to us. It was supposed to have happened already. We've been told it wasn't cost effective since most of our lots are 2 acres or larger so they were going after older neighborhoods on smaller lots. The minimum to build in this area is 2 acres. Many wells went dry because of a peeker plant that was built. They may have to bring in city water if newly drilled wells go dry. For now this is what we have. We've been told that when they bring city water and sewers in that it is the responsibility of the homeowner to connect and that we have to do it at our own expense. Rumor was we'd be given 3 years to do it. We checked costs a while ago. Around $8,000 to connect. How would you like to be the guy whose well or sewer goes out a year or two before they bring in the city water and sewer? Our well went dry a couple years ago and we paid to re-drill that several hundred feet deeper. We can only hope that our septic field holds out until the city water comes in.
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Old 05-15-2009, 08:34 PM   #20
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the more I think about it, and experience it, the more I think this whole environmental consciousness, green living thing is for yuppies who have the money to burn. Yes, there are things us "po folk" can do, and I do/have done them.

For instance, I got my car for $5K. It has a big honkin' 8 cyl engine.

A Prius costs what...$30K? I'll buy a Prius in 10 years, when they have the bugs worked out of it.

My advisor at school is the one with the Prius. She's always lecturing the rest of us on car-pooling and environmentally friendly everything. Fine.

But HEEELLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOO Mrs. Professor...I didn't reproduce. Having children is not environmentally friendly, when you get right down to it. Which means my carbon footprint is a lot less than yours, professor, even though I have an 8 cyl. fast car. I don't do as much environmental damage as you and your spawn do, which, if you were really serious about the cause, you wouldn't have had.
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