Wildlife Gardeners - North American Wildlife Gardening  

Go Back   Wildlife Gardeners - North American Wildlife Gardening > Wildlife Gardeners of North America Unite > Natural Areas

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-23-2009, 08:13 PM   #11
Unicellular Fungi
 
TheLorax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Default

Quote:
When would it not be okay to collect plants from someone's property, even if you have the owner's permission?
I believe harvesting from the wilds, regardless of whether they’re on public or private lands, is a big no no. It’s simply not pc any longer to subscribe to these practices with so many viable options to include collecting from nurseries and collecting from urban areas.

We have many wondrous indigenous North American species but please know many are barely eeking out an existence as a result of factors out of our control. I don't believe there to exist such a thing as ethical collecting by anyone without an educational need to so who has been properly trained. It's an oxymoron. Given all we've learned in the recent past, I can't think of a rational reason other than to save a buck for collectors to be out there harvesting from the wilds. So many of these plants are in cultivation and readily available. Even the scientific community wouldn't dream of taking a plant for an herbarium specimen or collecting seed if there weren't at least 100 specimens documented as being present in a given plant community yet it would appear it's a-ok in the eyes of collectors to do so if there is more than one present if all other underlying issues were addressed? I'm in the camp that taking "just one" more can, has made, and continues to make a difference. I always instruct students to think of the butterfly effect. I've provided a link for those interested in the event one is unfamiliar with the Ray Bradbury book in which the far-reaching ripple effect on subsequent events by one butterfly has its origin-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butterfly_effect

I have created workshops where children are provided with old socks and instructed to run around in them a few times over the course of the next week and to drop them in zip locks to bring back to the next workshop. We then grow the socks. Yup, each child grows out their socks in sterlite shoebox containers labeled with each child’s name. Occasionally, a recognizable native seedling will pop up however the vast majority of what germinates will be weeds. Given each child is coming from a different residential area, not all the weeds growing on socks are the same. The kids make the connection, can we? And herein lies how collectors can unwittingly introducing undesirables to both private and public wilds.

I can't tell you how many sites I've visited across the US that have been trampled by collectors and infested with weeds brought in on their clothing and on the soles of their shoes all to be able to get their hands on those "specimens" they covet with characteristics desirable to them with "free" being at the top of the list. These people are collectively doing a incredible amount of damage to the wilds.

To the best of my knowledge, there is no permit available to a plant collector which would enable them to extract anything from public wilds because it’s illegal. Permits to collect from the public wilds are for scientific and/or educational and/or research purposes with little exception.

Quote:
If future generations are to remember us with gratitude rather than contempt, we must leave them something more than the miracles of our technology. We must leave them a glimpse of the world as it was in the beginning, not just after we got through with it.”
-President Lyndon B. Johnson
__________________
"In the end we will conserve only what we love; we will love only what we understand; we will understand only what we have been taught."
-Baba Dioum, Senegalese ecologist
TheLorax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 09:11 PM   #12
Heron
 
Prairiefreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: NE IL, USA
Default

Many, many sites have now prohibited the collecting by "students"(thank Jah) and their "professors" because although they were collecting with permits, they were using it as an excuse to collect some species, to be grown in a "lab" at a college, and never to be seen in the wild again, i.e., they were collecting to preserve their scholastic reputations, then never did anything other than preserve the species for their own use, i.e., the stuff died in the greenhouse, or lived on, on the grounds of the school. Some of these jerks tried to apply for patents for the native plants they "rescued."

Just because they're children doesn't give them a pass. Your boy scout troop doesn't get to collect rare species. Ever, ever, ever. People who know what they're doing, do. Them's the breaks, folks.
Prairiefreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 09:21 PM   #13
WG Facilitator
 
biigblueyes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Cajun Country, Louisiana, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLorax View Post
I believe harvesting from the wilds, regardless of whether they’re on public or private lands, is a big no no. It’s simply not pc any longer to subscribe to these practices with so many viable options to include collecting from nurseries and collecting from urban areas.
It sounds like "from the wilds" is your sticking point?

We know someone who bought a lot in our subdivision, moved a house in to remodel, and nothing. The grass, weeds and wildflowers are chest high. I know I'd have no problem getting his permission to go collect some of those yellow wildflower seeds from his front yard to spread in my vacant lot around the corner. Does this also fall in the big "no no" category for you?
__________________
My yarden and I lean a little to the wild side.
biigblueyes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 09:33 PM   #14
Heron
 
Prairiefreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: NE IL, USA
Default

Big Blue Eyes, If you have permission to collect on his land, this is obviously not a problem.

I'd first check out what those yellow "wildflowers" were before I'd plant them anywhere. JMO.

Last edited by Prairiefreak; 01-23-2009 at 09:35 PM. Reason: blah
Prairiefreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 09:34 PM   #15
Unicellular Fungi
 
TheLorax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Default

I know people who own hundreds of acres of high quality private wilds. I know people who own an acre or two of high quality wilds. Most of the people plucking from the wilds haven't a clue how to meet the cultural requirements of the plant they plucked and they don't take the other species growing naturally with them which further reduces their chances of survival in a home landscape. I'd be curious to know what the mortality rate is on plants plucked from the wilds. It's got to be astronomically high.

Somebody like Stoloniferous wants to come over to my house, I'll share with her from my private property what is growing prolifically because I believe in spreading out the wealth and she'd do her darnedest to take care of the plant properly. She's not a collector.

It's the collectors and hoarders I have a problem with. They've done irrepairable damage.
__________________
"In the end we will conserve only what we love; we will love only what we understand; we will understand only what we have been taught."
-Baba Dioum, Senegalese ecologist
TheLorax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 09:48 PM   #16
Heron
 
Prairiefreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: NE IL, USA
Default

I grow uncommon natives...plants that are locally rare or extirpated in my area. I also have the more common ones, too. I'm quite happy to let people come over and have at them, as long as I know they know how to take care of them...especially the rare ones. I ain't giving them away to grade school groups or cub scouts or whatever.

I do not agree that collectors do irreperable damage. Wild collectors do. Collectors and home gardeners can be a bulwark against extinction. I collect rare native plants. They are not wild collected. Hellooooo, you tell me you have the right conditions to take care of and grow Silene regia...you get some Silene regia. Otherwise, no, you don't. A bunch of school kids ain't going to get any Silene regia from me.
Prairiefreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 09:50 PM   #17
Unicellular Fungi
 
TheLorax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Default

Quote:
I do not agree that collectors do irreperable damage. Wild collectors do.
You would be correct. I should have made the distinction. Thanks for clarifying.
__________________
"In the end we will conserve only what we love; we will love only what we understand; we will understand only what we have been taught."
-Baba Dioum, Senegalese ecologist
TheLorax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 10:03 PM   #18
Grub
 
trout lily's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Default

Interesting discussion. Ethics. I've read the Ray Bradbury story and it's chilling if I'm thinking of the right one that has a dinosaur...Here's a dilemma and a question. Each winter the town DPW spreads salt on my road after our many snowstorms. The Joe Pye-Weed, NE Asters, tall meadow rue, are disappearing from the roadside near my house; I'm an experienced enough gardener to be able to transplant them to my yard. Yes, I will disturb a site. Yes, I take the chance that my transplanting may fail. My rationale is that the roadside is disturbed and weedy already and unless I intervene, these native plants will die out entirely. The town owns the roadside. Would you transplant them or not?
trout lily is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 10:06 PM   #19
Unicellular Fungi
 
TheLorax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Default

Yes but I would ask permission. Very rarely do they say no.
__________________
"In the end we will conserve only what we love; we will love only what we understand; we will understand only what we have been taught."
-Baba Dioum, Senegalese ecologist
TheLorax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2009, 10:11 PM   #20
WG Facilitator
 
biigblueyes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Cajun Country, Louisiana, USA
Default

ME? I'm chicken. If they're on a back road and I think I can save them from an almost certain death without being caught, I'd take a few to try to save. If they're on main street, I'd probably see if I can get someone who sounds almost official to say it's OK.

You sound brave - you'd probably go in broad daylight on main street to save them. If they arrest you for that, Trout Lily, I'll go visit you in jail. You name what kind of cookies you want me to bring, and I'll bring 'em.
__________________
My yarden and I lean a little to the wild side.
biigblueyes is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
collection”, “field

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2