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Old 02-25-2010, 01:11 AM   #41
Heron
 
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Originally Posted by gnomenative View Post
The only thing I have trapped is gophers with leg holds. But I feel as you do- feral=earned removal in my book...
Leg hold gopher trap ?

gnomenative you have stumped me ! The only gopher traps that I am aware of are all regarded as lethal , near instataneous kill , supposedly humane . I learned of another trick a year or two ago as to how to get gophers (no , not the gopher-getter , the propane fueled thingy where you have lots of boy fun blowing things up)


HEY , Havalotta , it does rabbits too!


BUNNY BLASTING




University of Arizona Cooperative extension service came up with an interesting gassing device , I will show it and thier other recommendations as to gopher control ;

The University of Arizona Cooperative Extension - Yavapai County Horticulture - Pocket Gopher Control

Experimental gassing device ;

The University of Arizona Cooperative Extension - Yavapai County Horticulture - Experimental Pocket Gopher Control Device

I bought most of the pieces necessary to build the above device but have not had the pressing need to assemble it yet . It was/is not terribly expensive . A simple standard 5 gallon bucket , like a paint bucket . If you do not have one , one can be purchased at Home Depot for about 5 - 6 dollars . The fan or it's close equivelant can be had at Radio shack . Seems to me it ran about 20 - 25 dollars . The only other thing needed would be a bit of wire and a few bolts . If you have an old appliance just cut/remove the cord and pigtail it to the wires of the fan . Four small bolts with nuts and washers are all the else that is needed . Even if everything is bought new , should be less than $40.00 . Compared to the grief that a gopher can cause , I find it a small price .

Now gnomenative it is time for you to teach the teacher !

I want to know about your Leg hold gopher trap method ?

Turn about is fair play !

The trapping line is open .....

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Old 02-25-2010, 01:12 AM   #42
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"There ya go Suunto a-sprayin' those lethal/toxic chemicals aroun' agin .

Your off topic as usual , we WERE a-talkin' about live , non-lethal trapping .

Go to the corner and sit on the stool a-facin the wall until I say that you are allowed out !" I'm gonna have to go to the corner with suunto... we have a trap savvy feral tom cat that's been avoiding our traps for a year. It's stiiiiiiiiiil out there and my husband tells me he will shoot it. It killed his black squirrel baby that he watched for the last year so now he's finally fed up enough to do something about it. I've been fed up ever since it showed up out back. It did eat almost all of his squirrel but... that was my husband's favorite squirrel. We don't have the dog pack problems you have... thank God!!! Other towns do but we don't. People don't bat an eyelash peppering pack dogs where I live. They don't want feral dogs running down horses.
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Old 02-25-2010, 01:45 AM   #43
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"There ya go Suunto a-sprayin' those lethal/toxic chemicals aroun' agin .

Your off topic as usual , we WERE a-talkin' about live , non-lethal trapping .

Go to the corner and sit on the stool a-facin the wall until I say that you are allowed out !" I'm gonna have to go to the corner with suunto... we have a trap savvy feral tom cat that's been avoiding our traps for a year. It's stiiiiiiiiiil out there and my husband tells me he will shoot it. It killed his black squirrel baby that he watched for the last year so now he's finally fed up enough to do something about it. I've been fed up ever since it showed up out back. It did eat almost all of his squirrel but... that was my husband's favorite squirrel. We don't have the dog pack problems you have... thank God!!! Other towns do but we don't. People don't bat an eyelash peppering pack dogs where I live. They don't want feral dogs running down horses.
Now I'm not-a-sayin' that I am above such methods myself ! I have been known to employ shotguns against dogs . Which almost led to the showdown at lonediver's corral , me facing the neighbor on my property after I taught a few of his dogs a lesson . My wife was witness to this of two men facing each other with loaded shotguns , fingers on the triggers . She called the sheriff to referee . He came with red lights a flashin' . The sheriff KNEW that sometimes I have a righteous temper and have a relutance to back down from a fight !

Both parties survived , but the other guy got a tounge lashing from the sheriff for bringing a shotgun to a party at my place .

Far be it for me to not employ firearms WHEN necessary and apropriate .

Aridzona also has different laws applying to different locales , back then we lived in a different area where RANGE LAW applied/was king ;

(give me a few minutes , I am trying to find range law )

Having a little difficulty finding the statutes just now but something along the lines of the below gives one an idea ;

My Neighbor's Dog Has Repeatedly Chased And At Times Injured My Livestock. Can I Kill My Neighbor's Dog?

Yes. If you see your neighbor's dog harassing your livestock, by chasing them or worrying them, you are justified in killing the dog with no liability to your neighbor, so long as your livestock are on your property when they are being harassed. You may also notify the neighbor about their dog's behavior and they will have 24 hours to kill their dog after you have notified them, and if they do not kill their dog you can notify a law enforcement officer who will kill the dog.
This rule does not apply to dogs that are being used to herd cattle under the direction of their owner, or dogs that are being used for hunting or predator control under the direction of their owner.
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Old 02-25-2010, 03:01 AM   #44
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For some odd reason I cannot find the revised statute in Aridzona but here is a case out of Oregon where the finer points of thier range law was argued . A bit dry but a little interesting ;

Roach v. Jackson County

Some of the high lights ;

FN2. ORS 609.157 provides, in its entirety:
"A disputable presumption shall arise that a dog has been engaged in killing, wounding, injuring or chasing livestock within the meaning of ORS 609.140 and 609.155 if:
"(1) The dog is found chasing livestock not the property of the owner of the dog in an area where freshly damaged livestock are found;
"(2) The dog is found feeding upon a warm carcass of a livestock animal;
"(3) An examination of the dog's feces indicates ingestion of portions of the anatomy or covering of the anatomy of livestock by the dog; or
"(4) Portions of the anatomy or covering of the anatomy of livestock is found on the teeth of the dog, unless the dog is regularly used for the purpose of herding sheep."
Plaintiff argues that when the above statutes are read together, it is apparent that a dog may not be destroyed for merely chasing livestock unless the dog also causes some injury to the livestock or had an intent to cause harm. According to plaintiff, the fact that ORS 609.157(1) requires livestock damage before a presumption of chasing arises means that the legislature intended that the dog cause some type of injury before it can be found to have "chased" livestock. He concludes:
"If evidence of livestock damage is needed to create a presumption of chasing, how can it not be equally essential to proof of the fact? If it is not unlawful to 'own, harbor or keep' a dog that has chased but caused no damage and if a dog which has chased without injury is not a public nuisance subject to summary execution by 'any person,' is it not unreasonable and inconsistent with the statutory scheme to interpret 'chase' in any manner which does not make damage or at least predatory intent an essential element of proof?" (Emphasis in original.)
We disagree with plaintiff's argument that there must be proof that the horse was harmed. The operative words in ORS 609.155(3)(a) have discrete meanings. A dog need not kill or wound livestock for the statute to apply. In context, the word "injuring" connotes a situation where there is no physical contact between the dog and the livestock, but the livestock is injured as a result of the dog's actions. [FN3] Similarly, the statute is implicated when the dog merely chases livestock without injury or wounding occurring. It is apparent that the legislature recognized the potential of harm to livestock by a dog merely chasing livestock and sought to prevent that potential harm.
FN3. For example, livestock could become injured as a result of the dog's actions even though the dog never came into contact with the animal because of running into a fence or similar barrier.
Plaintiff's argument regarding the need for proof of a predatory intent also fails. If the legislature had intended to require a predatory intent as an element of ORS 609.155(3)(a), it would have said so. We are prohibited from adding words to the statute. ORS 174.010. [FN4] Also, there is nothing in the connotation of "chasing" that requires a predatory intent. "To chase" includes a meaning of "to follow usually rapidly and intently." Webster's Third New Int'l Dictionary 379 (unabridged ed 1993). Under the language of the statute, a dog could "chase" livestock for pleasure and still fall within the purview of the statute.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Interestin' huh ?

What it boils down is that in rural counties livestock is king . A dog so much as looks at livestock with crossed eyes and the dog's life span is shortened considerably ! I lived by that law where it applied . And I am more than a fair/good shooter . Believe me !

The only thing that I was a-tryin' to say to Suunto is that we/I was a tryin' to give the more gentler methods first before we got to the gorier stuff . I was a-trying to give those gentler folks a chance to get a chance to learn what they could before they bailed on the thread .

OK by you Annie Oakley (Equil) ? (teasing)
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Old 02-25-2010, 03:37 AM   #45
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You really did learn a lot!
Swoosh.......... The obvious went right over my head until you pointed it all out in black and white....
Yup, Coves would make one feel more secure and I can see why they wouldn't enter with the wires going between their toes and pads......
Thank you! I'm going to get a rabbit. I'm going to get a rabbit.... When I find the cage.... Hmmmm Now where did I put it?
One thing that I have never figured about wimmen ? Leaves me a scratchin'my head ! That when they go clothes shopping and buy all them frilly dresses and then they have this need to ACCESSORISE !

Well toys like traps need to be accessorised also !

Lesson learned ?

Truth is , I've been a bit of a trapper a good part of my life . Considered taking it up professionally back in my twenties, did some studyin' on it then . But the wife sqwuaked a bit about my being away for 4 or 5 months at a crack and she seemed to think that she might have difficulty trying to find me in the mountains . So she got her way AGAIN ! I wound up stayin' home to become the gentle folk that you see before you today .

I went to the trappers hoo haw to refine my skills .

The trapping line is caught up and open for questions again ..........

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Old 02-25-2010, 08:09 AM   #46
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I humbly apologize for getting things off topic with the lead spray bit; my wife being agin hunting in general, I usually opt for a non-lethal approach to pest removal. However, in this instance, the whistle-pig had ignored all enticements to enter a camouflaged and baited (ripe tomato) Havahart, and insisted on climbing our young peach trees to eat the fruit, damaging many branches in the process. Enough was enough...
To get back on track, I may relate a somewhat amusing (to me, anyway) skunk tale (not tail) later.
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Old 02-25-2010, 08:55 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by suunto View Post
I humbly apologize for getting things off topic with the lead spray bit; my wife being agin hunting in general, I usually opt for a non-lethal approach to pest removal. However, in this instance, the whistle-pig had ignored all enticements to enter a camouflaged and baited (ripe tomato) Havahart, and insisted on climbing our young peach trees to eat the fruit, damaging many branches in the process. Enough was enough...
To get back on track, I may relate a somewhat amusing (to me, anyway) skunk tale (not tail) later.
You're Ok Suunto , I sense that you are my kind of guy . It's just that I know that trapping, and some things are contreversial . So I was attempting to follow a curiculum . SNAFU 's as normal , so goes life . You are allowed out of the corner now , you had your knuckles rapped . Please attempt to behave yourself .

P.S. Possibly a lesson I need to learn myself . The wife is going to the water district meeting for the first time ever with me tonight . I think that she is afraid of fireworks when I get to confront that project engineer in person for the first time since "THE INCIDENT" . ;

The death of a nest ! - help

The wife has such a suspicous nature , I tell the wife "WHO, ME ? . Ask my mother who knows me to be a sweet innocent child never capable of mayhem . "

The trapping line is open .......

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