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Old 06-02-2009, 03:17 PM   #11
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when does a naturalized, exotic or translocated plant or animal become "native"?
I'll always be a native of Louisiana, no matter where I end up. Same with plants.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:28 PM   #12
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Okay. So, when does a naturalized, exotic or translocated plant or animal become "native"? For example, all "native" flora and fauna of the Hawaiian islands.
According to the definitions by the NRCS, never.

I'm not sure what your point is about about Hawaii. Do you live in Hawaii? Are you concerned about native landscapes in Hawaii? If we have a native gardener from Hawaii post on the forum, perhaps they could answer a more specific question. I would assume there was lots of native vegetation on the islands before the polynesians inhabited it.... but I would also bet the polynesians brought some plants along with them when they migrated. I would imagine that botanists can make a distinction of plants commonly found in the Pacific Islands to determine which ones were imported and which ones were not?

And other continents of course, would need to use a different definitions for Native. I'm not sure, if we have European, African or Asian gardeners on this forum.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:34 PM   #13
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As defined above the term "native" always has a "geographic qualifier".

Peonies are native to Siberia. No matter how many you plant in the UK or the USA.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:38 PM   #14
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"I'm not sure, if we have European, African or Asian gardeners on this forum." Supposedly North Americans. I noticed a spattering of other English speaking gardeners from other countries who are posting in the composting area. I'm certainly enjoying their posts in those areas of this site.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:49 PM   #15
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Okay. So, when does a naturalized, exotic or translocated plant or animal become "native"? For example, all "native" flora and fauna of the Hawaiian islands.
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Never
Fearless, as you may be aware, Hawaii was created by volcanoes. Every creature living there arrived either by floating, flying, or human transport. Those creatures that arrived there before humans are considered native. But by your definition, there is no such thing as a native Hawaiian plant or animal. So which is it? Either a naturalized, exotic or translocated plant can at some point become "native", or nothing in Hawaii is "native".
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:49 PM   #16
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Default Noxious Weed - Nuances of the Legal Context

The Plant Protection Act also states that "In the case of noxious weeds, the Secretary [of Agriculture] may publish, by regulation, a list of noxious weeds that are prohibited or restricted from entering the United States or that are subject to restrictions on interstate movement within the United States." So, while the Plant Protection Act states that any pest plant can be a noxious weed, in practice, it is really only the listed noxious weeds that are regulated and they are often non-native. Many states have similar regulations that apply for their states.

More information on the USDA APHIS noxious weed program can be found at USDA - APHIS - Plant Health, Plant Protection and Quarantine

Last edited by dchang; 06-02-2009 at 03:54 PM. Reason: grammar
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:50 PM   #17
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I'm not sure what your point is about about Hawaii. Do you live in Hawaii? Are you concerned about native landscapes in Hawaii?
FYI, I used to live in Hawaii, among other locations, but I don't see why concern with an area ought to be tied with residency. The native birds in Hawaii are of particular concern, having been wiped out by mongeese, which were brought in by humans to combat the rats that rode over on ships. Goats have also wrecked havoc over there.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:58 PM   #18
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The Plant Protection Act also states that "In the case of noxious weeds, the Secretary [of Agriculture] may publish, by regulation, a list of noxious weeds that are prohibited or restricted from entering the United States or that are subject to restrictions on interstate movement within the United States." So, while the Plant Protection Act states that any pest plant can be a noxious weed, in practice, it is really only the listed noxious weeds that are regulated and they are often non-native. Many states have similar regulations that apply for their states.

More information on the USDA APHIS noxious weed program can be found at USDA - APHIS - Plant Health, Plant Protection and Quarantine
Thank you for the info dchang!
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Old 06-02-2009, 04:01 PM   #19
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There were people living on the American continent that moved plants around long before the Europeans came. They even cultivated plants and selectively pollinated plants creating a cultivars to produce desired results.

The definition of native, as we are using for the continent of North America is probably not applicable to an Island on the Pacific, nor should it be.
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Old 06-02-2009, 04:18 PM   #20
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The definition of native, as we are using for the continent of North America is probably not applicable to an Island on the Pacific, nor should it be.
I'm not sure I can accept that.

A volcano creates an island in the pacific. Plants and animals move in.

A volcano creates a lifeless desert on mainland America. Plants and animals move in.

There is no difference aside from a bit of water around the edges.
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